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Delta Airlines plane skids off JFK runway

Soumis
 
A Delta Airlines plane skidded off an icy runway and into the snow at JFK Airport on Sunday morning, authorities said, no injuries were reported. (www.nydailynews.com) Plus d'info...

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Learjetsales
Chris Griffith 3
BFD, if everyone here had 150,000lbs of aluminum stuck to their butts on an icy, low visibility taxiway or runway with two big jets producing just idle trust, it can be a real test of wits.
hardworker7
hardworker7 5
DAL seems to have issue w/keeping acft on surfaces that are other than bone-dry. Isnt this the third incident in a month of this kind?
dtw757
mike SUT 4
This wasn't a Delta jet. It was a regional aircraft operated by Pilots trained by their own parent corporation. Their only connection to Delta is just that..they are a feeder to the Delta mainline. They have a Delta paint job BUT it says "connection" on it. Yes, there was a mainline 737 that went into the mud after trying to do a crossbleed start while taxiing on an icy spot on the taxiway. But this isn't a Delta Airlines aircraft, crew. That's the problem with marketing a product. The wrong people get all the heat.
preacher1
preacher1 3
It totally pisses me off when this CONNECTION and CONTRACT crap keeps coming up. No denying that it is true but being as DAL's name, or any other for that matter, is on the side, the liability is there and if the parent airline does not exercise their control to standards for those crews, it does not relieve them of responsibility for their actions. All the general public or a court of law will look at is DAL on the side. And just for general info, the 2 at MSN a couple weeks ago were BOTH 737's and those aren't contracted; they were home boys.
preacher1
preacher1 2
That was just a pet peeve so thanks for allowing me to vent. Had it not been raised before it wouldn't have mattered. In response to HARDWORKER7 up above here, how many flights per day does DAL launch/recover in/out of a crappy airport and minor mishaps with only 2, a few days apart. That really don't sound like anything major. It may be coincidental that they were both at MSN but other than that, no big deal.
preacher1
preacher1 1
Seems like there were 2 737's in less than a week apart at MSN a couple weeks back
PhotoFinish
PhotoFinish 3
All of these incidents seem to be more about airports getting behind in cleaning their taxiways.

I would've expected such incidents down south (eg. at Dallas) when getting unexpected and unusual snow and ice. It is more shocking to have so many incidents up north, especially at places like MSP, that live in snow most of winter.
preacher1
preacher1 2
Could be they have happened all along and they are just now being reported. It has just been a single airline though, and to boot, a very small % of those, in proportion to their number of daily flights, which would point away from the airport having a problem. A lot of the Southern Hubs take a close look at wx and don't get too far behind on their stuff.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
Do keep in mind that these are in times of the Polar Vortex and even for the North it is colder and worse than they are used too.
PhotoFinish
PhotoFinish 2
That's got to be it. With the Polar Vortex, it has been much colder than usual. Even heard of reports that deicing solution that was freezing up.

Treated taxiways could've frozen up when the temp drops below the freezing point of whatever was used to treat the surface (in solution with water and ice).

I walked and drove on treated surfaces that were somewhat melted one hour and totally frozen over the next, when the temperature dropped.

Suspect the laws of physics help up on taxiways similarly.
clabo
In Iceland and other Scandinavian countries, they have, quite literally, heated streets. Hot water (maybe steam?) runs through pipes which heats the surface of the roadways to keep them from icing up.

I imagine that even at larger APs, there ain't all that many miles of rwy/twy that they can even phase-in the plumbing, and keep surfaces naturally clean, vs plowing and chemical-treatment. I'd imagine the one-time cost to install, and small ongoing maintenance/energy costs, vs ongoing costs for snow equipment, personnel, storage, tons of deicing chemicals, etc., might actually make financial sense.

Try it it KMSP, PANC, etc., first, as a pilot (haha) program, then see if it makes sense for other APs.
PhotoFinish
PhotoFinish 1
Only makes sense during a scheduled reconstruction. Otherwise it doesn't make sense to interrupt the use of perfectly runways and taxiways. Nor to pay good money to rip up good expensive concrete to save a few bucks.

Even when reconstructing runways and taxiways, it only makes sense to install all this extra plumbing, if doing so doesn't greatly increase the cost of the reconstruction nor greatly increase the down time while reconstructing.

In most cases, they're struggling to try to get the work done as quickly as possible to try to minimize the adverse impact on operations.

Now if you're talking about building an entirely new airport from scratch (while operations continue at another older airport to be replaced) in a part of the world that gets long, icy winters, oh yeah. Your idea would make much sense.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
Problems come in 3's... Hope this is the last one.
myronswanson
myron swanson 1
ut oh...
Doobs
Dee Lowry 1
It's that time of year to slide off runways and taxiways. Again, it's a common occurance- a non event. Runways and Taxiways are always a concern whether they are prepared or not but give Delta a break. They were landing on ice topped with snow and the temp was unbelievably low. "Polar Vortex". I can remember in KMSP...it was so fricking cold we couldn't even start the bird up! In that kind of extreme weather it's amazing there aren't more incidents.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
Talking about cold... I had a mechanics at KFAR, KBIS, and KMOT with Heater Carts similar to Herman Nelson Heaters just to heat the A/C battery just to have enough battery power to turn the APU Starter... (Herman Nelson Heater reference "http://www.hermannelson.com/Categories.aspx?cgrp=1" for those not familiar with them... When the high is 40 below F... Things get a bit sluggish...
Doobs
Dee Lowry 1
Sparkie... sluggie seems pretty mild. We and several others were in the same boat. Only happened once, in my career. We literally were in the "frozen mode"...no way out, no way coming to life any time soon! "Canceled"!!!!
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
Have had a few of those... I know what you are talking about... Look at an old TV Program Buffalo Airways, and Ice Pilots which is the same program renamed. They were not faking it... That is the real thing.
planotxwx
Dave Wood 1
Registration/Tail #? I see CRJ200's all the time in and out of KDFW.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
N8758D, S/N 7758, Registered to "WELLS FARGO BANK NORTHWEST NA TRUSTEE " and flown by Endeavor Air formally Pinnacle Airlines. If you see them out of KDFW this could be one of them as they have a lot of CRJ-200's and 900's in and out of their.
skylloyd
skylloyd 1
When I read this story I understood it skidded off of the taxi-way, and was pulled to the terminal without further incident, am I reading this wrong?
preacher1
preacher1 1
Well, you are correct, depending on who you believe. The 1st part of the story says it slid off 22L and hit the snow, hence the closure. DAL at the end of the articles says it slipped off a taxiway and was towed on into the terminal, so idk.
Midwaymike
Mike Lowe 1
Look folks lets get something straight here, THIS IS NOT A DELTA AIRLINES JET, THESE WERE NOT DELTA AIRLINES PILOTS!!!!!!!. This was a Rat Jet (RJ) operated by and flown by subcontractors!!! NOT DAL people! I understand that the NY Daily News needs to get their shit strait too.

DAL may have had a few slide offs this year, contrast that with the incredible number of flights Delta flys every single day. How does your company stack up? Additionally DAL cancelled only about 2% of flights during the cold snap of the century last week…How did your favorite airline stack up? DAL seems to have made the transition to FAR 117 fairly smoothly too…How did yours do? Before we all go pointing fingers at each other maybe we need to make sure our own reflections are distorted as well.
PhotoFinish
PhotoFinish 1
Lots of airlines had issues with the cold, ice, snow and freezing rain of the last few weeks, that were of record setting weather events.

JetBlue has had quite some trouble with the new pilot rest rules. I can't imagine those summer thunderstorm delays will be any more kind to them. They're based out of busy JFK. With their stratospheric growth over the last decade, they're spread thin in staffing. The new rest rules make it even harder on them. Tbey'll need to staff up, just for wx delays.

They may have to schedule crews for more more days a month with shorter scheduled work days, to minimize the chance that individual crews go past their new maximum daily work hours.

And they'll need to increase their reserve crews scheduled, particularly on wx days.
akplanefreak
Aaron OBrien 1
Looks like Delta could use some lessons from Alaska Airlines.
JerrySteinberg
Airport had been reopened for over an hour by the time this was posted here
swaaflyus
Mark Gorodnick 0
(Duplicate Squawk Submitted)

New York's JFK Airport temporarily shut after plane skids off icy runway

plane landing at New York's John F. Kennedy International Airport skidded off an icy runway just after 8 a.m. Sunday, prompting officials to temporarily shut down the airport, authorities said

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2014/01/05/22188122-new-yorks-jfk-airport-temporarily-shut-after-plane-skids-off-icy-runway?lite
JerrySteinberg
(Duplicate Squawk Submitted)

JFK Closed After Delta Plane Skids Off Runway

A Delta Air Lines plane skidded off an icy runway at John F. Kennedy International Airport in New York on Sunday morning, and the airport closed shortly thereafter.

Delta Flight 4100, which departured Toronto, Canada Sunday morning, touched down on runway 22L shortly before 8 a.m. ...

http://www.frequentbusinesstraveler.com/2014/01/jfk-closed-after-delta-plane-skids-off-runway/
DiversionD
Darryl Sarno 0
(Duplicate Squawk Submitted)

Plane skids off runway at JFK

A Delta CRJ skidded off a runway at JFK due to icy conditions. The airport was closed, but has since re-opened and everyone appears to be OK.

http://news.yahoo.com/plane-jfk-runway-140819585.html

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