Back to Squawk list
  • 15

U.S. airlines don’t need a bailout to stay in business

Soumis
 
With flight bookings in free fall, U.S. airlines have gone to Washington with their hands out, asking for more than $50 billion in loans. Yet there is no danger that the airlines are about to disappear, leaving the flying public grounded after the coronavirus crisis passes. Without a bailout, the air carriers would renegotiate their terms of credit with their lenders outside court, or they would file for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection. Either way, they would keep flying. (www.washingtonpost.com) Plus d'info...

Sort type: [Top] [Newest]


JBcap767
John Buch 9
The author may be an expert in law but he absolutely failed economics 101! Without loans and grants the airlines WOULD have to lay off hundreds thousands of employees. With no passengers flying, the flights wont go and with no flights, employees will be fired..DA! The inertia will roll down hill to suppliers and of course fired employees will not spend money for years. This example is tantamount to the Great Recession that had 10-15% unemployment. If the government did not loan/grant money to the car manufacturers, we would have had 25% unemployment and a Depression! Instead, the loans were made and paid off early and the economy grew for the next 10 years!Airlines are a HUGE part of commerce. Fordham should fire this professor and then he will see how not being employed works in his ignorant, myopic life.
Quirkyfrog
Robert Cowling 5
The real question is, though, 'How much do you give away', and 'to whom'.

How much money can the government give to industry, especially an industry guilty of irresponsible spending in the past. And an industry that claims there is no money left for employees and continues to shower management and investors with incredible amounts of money.

My fear is that in an election year, trump will give away far too much to far too many illogical choices and irrelevant industries, and this country will never survive from it.

Supporting the airline industry does make a certain amount of sens, if the majority of that support goes to the employees that will be most effected. Provide 6 months pay for the flight attendants, the ground crews, the reservation people, the airport support people. Do NOT shower the management teams and investors with money. Aside from what they think, they DID NOT make the airlines great. They made the airlines poor!

Supporting the oil gas and fracking companies shouldn't even be thought of. Fracking should have never been a thing in the first place, and oil shale is so backend loaded with destruction, it should be stopped as well.

Restaurant employees should be heavily supported, especially wait staff. The wages that far too many of the wait staff in this country are less than starvation wages, less than the minimum wage.Give them 6 months of full pay. Pay the cooks, dishwashers, janitors. Pay the grocery workers, stockers, drivers. Pay the people that REALLY move this country, and not the parasites that are bleeding it dry. (And make sure that the trump family doesn't get a penny of any of the money, EVER!!!

I knew someone who made 2+ million a year. That was gross pay on both levels. He had three homes, four airplanes, a collection of exotic sports cars, and one of the last times I ever saw him, was complaining about the economy. How 'hard' it was to live. He was flying down to Hilton Head that weekend to spend a week golfing and trolling for his next ex-wife. I just got nauseated by his total lack of comprehension of who 'the rest of us' lives. I heard he's gone through another 2 wives, and bought a new jet. The .01% will never get it, and they will continue to be parasites. I'm sure he got a massive tax cut recently too. He'll vote for trump. Just look at the return on investment. He's not given to a political candidate in decades according to opensecrets.org.
ICMI
ICMI 1
Very few people are flying right now anyway. Shutdown operations for awhile, or reduce the schedule. Let the market decide who survives. Just a more laissez-faire way to look at it. The aerospace industry will eventually rebound on its own.
MSUSparty
MSU Sparty 14
Of course this author wants them to file Chap 11 because he teaches bankruptcy law. He has no understanding of the trickle down effect on suppliers and their financials and employees and their retirement plans. If you go to Fordham, skip this guys class it is not real world.
brock55
brock55 4
The guy has no clue how the industry works. You are dead on about the suppliers suffering because any debt owed to them will be tied up in court. The airlines work with companies that are not huge companies and even a $20k invoice will greatly affect the company. He needs to focus on what the textbook he is teaching from says and let the professionals run the industry. Maybe he was the only one the Post could get to make those statements.
bdjam
Brian James 7
The airlines have been spending their money buying back their own stock so that they can inflate the price and their company's value. The American public needs the bailout, not the corporations. If the public has no money, they won't fly when this is all over. 

I find it interesting that everyone clamors for the capitalist model, but at the first sign of trouble people want to socialize corporations like airlines and cruise lines and hotels. But socializing help to the people - who need it most - is called out as being anti American.
CPsarras
Christos Psarras 3
Exactly, when the times were good they went drunk spending all the money on THEMSELVES instead of saving for the unavoidable bad time/downturn, and now they come crying to papa. If we are to lend them money, it has to come with strings attached.
ukusapkm07201942
Paul Miller 7
It's really Two Sided in some ways ? The Airlines when they are all most doing well ? ramp UP the prices and we (the average joe In The Street) are forced to pay them (Plus Luggage Cost's too) ? but as soon as something comes along to ruin their large profit's, then within weeks they are all asking that same Tax payer in the street to bail them out !!!! Or do I see this in the wrong light maybe >
sparkie624
sparkie624 2
Without the bail out... A lot of us here are going to have even more time to discuss this issue while we are unemployed.
ICMI
ICMI 3
Let the market decided. Only the strong will survive. Aren’t Airlines historically bad investments? Why give airlines a bailout?
Quirkyfrog
Robert Cowling 3
Especially since they spent the last cash handouts buying their stock to inflate the price and get their investors and management bonuses.
wbannan
William Bannan 1
There may be no chance for the majors to disappear, but this may very well thin out the herd for the regionals.. this is also kind of unprecedented in the length the airlines will have to scale back and the amount of aircraft parked I believe
jmilleratp
jmilleratp 1
Loans are fine. It's when it's just money handed out that I have issues with it.
harv1l
Harvey Mills 1
I am a flight attendant for a major airline. Name is not as important as this is happening at all airlines. Just 3 days ago I was working a flight from Chicago(ORD) to Salt Lake City(SLC) with 8 total passengers on it. The return flight from SLC to ORD had a larger passenger count of "14" total. I want the author to know that I need my job and the airlines with no fault of their own (remember we have had at least 3-4 years of record profits) did not foresee this and need assistance now to be viable when this all passes.
CPsarras
Christos Psarras 2
Yes Harvey, I understand, but you said it yourself: "(remember we have had at least 3-4 years of record profits)" Soooo, where did all those profits go??? Also you say, the airlines "did not foresee this", yes, but when they did have lots of profits they decided it was very wise to buy back stock and give out all those bonuses to management instead of saving for a rainy day...
watkinssusan
mary susan watkins 2
christos..you are 100% correct..the airlines raked up large profits in these past few years, and did exactly what you said..to Harvey.no,it was not your fault specifically as an airline employee,but yes,it was the fault of the "upper echelon" management of the airlines,like delta and united and American,who all have gone the "want to be bigger" merger route (some to avoid filing bankruptcy)who have done the stock buybacks..you are aware I am guessing that these ceo's as part of their salary,which is overblown to begin with,receive very large amounts of stock options in their own company...I worked for 2 airlines for a total of 30 years,and saw a lot of downtimes and a lot of people get "furloughed"..i do understand the bad side of this..

[This poster has been suspended.]

kupuna11
Thomas Craig -3
Trump knows his business. There will be no airlines with Biden's no emissions platform.
CPsarras
Christos Psarras 1
Of course he knows his business, that's why he has 4 bankruptcies under his belt ...
kupuna11
Thomas Craig 0
The memory of a Democrat. Try to stay on point not politics
CPsarras
Christos Psarras -1
Ahh, the language-spinning of a Republican; unless we speak a different dialect of English, I fail to see where in my statement I mention politics, all I am doing is agreeing with YOUR point, he does know his business, that's why he has 4 bankruptcies under his belt. It is exactly on point to your point, and has nothing to do with politics, grow up.
kupuna11
Thomas Craig -1
Ahh, the language-spinning of a Democrat
CPsarras
Christos Psarras 0
Really dude???
CPsarras
Christos Psarras 0
Could you maybe point to the language-spinning part you are referring to?
kupuna11
Thomas Craig -1
Really dude??? Could you maybe point to the language-spinning part you are referring to?
Enough, moron! flightaware is for aviation news, not petty Psarras squabbling!
artjackson
Art Jackson 2
You represent your cult well.
CPsarras
Christos Psarras 1
Sorry, my apologies, I didn't realize you haven't taken your happy pill today.
kupuna11
Thomas Craig -1
Apology accepted.
artjackson
Art Jackson 1
If by “his business” you mean 1) how to blame all this on others, 2) take credit for someone else’s hard work, 3) not listen to sound advice from the people who’ve spent their careers on how to handle the economy and the pandemic, then yes he knows his business.

Trump will be the death of The United States.
kupuna11
Thomas Craig -3
More Democratic political nonsense. Post your non aviation comments on the Drudge Report please.
The money to the airlines was a loan. not welfare.
artjackson
Art Jackson 1
Mr. Craig, you made the first political comment in this thread by saying the airlines would cease to exist if “Biden’s no emissions platform” is enacted.

Are you implying I am not allowed to respond? I suspect that Mr. Biden’s proposal would not have the effect you claim. But why let that inconvenient fact get in the way of your argument?
kupuna11
Thomas Craig 0
So, while you are still in democrat mode, humor me and ex-plane what you meant and how it is prevalent here.

Trump will be the death of The United States
artjackson
Art Jackson 1
A week later and I’m still awaiting your reply. I must assume you have no facts with which to argue.

Facts suck when they aren’t on you side don’t they? But hey, reality has a well known liberal bias, right?
artjackson
Art Jackson 1
Nice deflection, but I don’t play that game. I know this is a difficult concept for you to grasp, but not everyone who expresses an opinion that doesn’t lavish praise and adoration on Trump is a Democrat.

So just to clarify, I was asking you to provide a credible source that supports your contention that Mr. Biden’s proposal will result in the demise of the airline industry. Credible sources do not include Fox “News” (especially from a propagandist talking head like Hannity or Tucker), Breitbart, or some obscure right-wing website. Try NPR or USA Today as an example.

I eagerly await your reply, Mr. Craig.
CPsarras
Christos Psarras 1
YOU are also more than welcome to post your non-aviation items somewhere else, that's an irrelevant point I guess, since you started it.

>>> The money to the airlines was a loan. not welfare <<<
Once again, spinning and deflection; nowhere the post you answered it mentioned that wasn't the case...

Se connecter

Vous n'avez pas de compte? Inscrivez-vous maintenant (gratuitement) pour des fonctionnalités personnalisées, des alertes de vols, et plus encore!
Ce site web utilise des cookies. En utilisant et en naviguant davantage sur ce site, vous acceptez cela.
Rejeter
Saviez-vous que le suivi des vols FlightAware est soutenu par la publicité ?
Vous pouvez nous aider à garder FlightAware gratuit en autorisant les annonces de FlightAware.com. Nous travaillons dur pour que notre publicité reste pertinente et discrète afin de créer une expérience formidable. Il est facile et rapide de mettre les annonces en liste blanche sur FlightAware ou d’examiner nos comptes premium.
Rejeter