Back to Squawk list
  • 12

Study Shows Millions In Savings For Airlines Reduced Flight Time For Travelers

Soumis
 
Airlines could save at least $65.6 million annually while slashing carbon emissions and cutting flight times by implementing new flight paths at 46 mid-size airports across the U.S., according to study results released by GE Aviation. The findings of the study, Highways in the Sky, come at a critical time in the debate on the future of our aging national (avstop.com) Plus d'info...

Sort type: [Top] [Newest]


preacher1
preacher1 0
What are we waiting on then, probably $.
ffdriver
Carl McLelland 0
So THIS is something NEW?? J. Lynn Helms already did this, back in the 70's. It was called "the Brown Book". It entailed "making every plane #1". A little "Voodoo magic", add some 'smoke-n-mirrors', do away with minimum separation in the air and on the runway and you got it. When the arrival rate for an airport is about one air carrier every five minutes you can let them make their tight approach without any delay vectoring for spacing/separation. Then, of course, the pilot must forsake his passengers comfort by making his approach akin to the approach to a carrier deck. And since all those people on the ground are going to complain your gonna have to stay higher longer, making a steeper descent.

The ONLY way to reduce the delays is to spread out the arrivals so everybody doesn't arrive at the same time. It's simple to calculate the climb, cruise and descent time for every airplane and route, then factor in the minimum separation criteria, and the computer will then publish the release time for departure. If the pilot deviates more than a mile from the prescribed route or misses a departure or arrival time by more than 30 seconds he receives a horrenduous fine and suspension. The fines pay for this new "super system" and since 90% of the crews will be on FAA mandated suspensions nobody will be flying thus no delays!

Did I mention all east coast commuter traffic would be between 2300-0300 local time to make this work?
preacher1
preacher1 0
Carl, old boy, I believe you have hit the nail on the head:)While the routings and separations are there to bring some kind of method to the madness, I don't think folks have really thought through all this direct and minimal separation business and while maybe not official, nobody has spoken out about just how much people comfort figures into what is there now.Let's try some of the full power, steep climbout, takeoffs or the "carrier deck" approaches, hard braking on landing to grab an earlier turnout than you planned to avoid ramming somebody slow that didn't clear the runway as he should have.When the uproar starts after all that, "HELL TO PAY" will be an undertatement.
ffdriver
Carl McLelland 0
Helms' "Brown Book" was based on the impossible concept that every arrival "arrived" at a point in time where it was "#1". It showed a bunch of airplanes on a non-existent microwave landing system that magically adjusted speed, spacing and time in a 'computer model' of perfection. Totally eliminating the human element made it possible. It also showed several aircraft on the runway at the same time, and imagine how, even with this perfect utilization of airspace and runway they got off all the departures without anybody ever "holding short" of the runway for an arriving aircraft.

I used to demonstrate why this concept wouldn't work by simply drawing a runway on a piece of paper, then putting an arriving aircraft at each of the four compass points at 250 knots, then asking the person to demonstrate how they get everybody down without using ANY delay vectors or speed control? As soon as they said "I'd slow this guy.." or "I'd turn that guy" I would remind them they cannot vector for spacing or use speed control... Yep.... the "Kobiashi Muru", the "no-win scenario"...

There is a solution... Wanna see it?
preacher1
preacher1 0
I am almost afraid to ask:)That 30 second departure miss is enough to bring tears to your eyes. I cannot count the # of times of being 2nd in line and the #1 guy being cleared, having my hand on the throttles in anticipation of going, and the #1, for whatever reason just sits there, or when I have gotten up there, got my clearance, and instead of shoving throttles and rolling, FE or FO hollers that something doesn't quite look or feel right, and you either hold a few extra seconds, or if you are rolling and it goes hinkey, and you have to abort, then you really screw up a controller's playhouse but there ain't a dang thing you can do about it, cause ain't nobody worth a flip gonna take a bird off the ground that's not 100%.
preacher1
preacher1 0
I will never forget way back in 1969, in the days before 911 when airports had Observation decks and you could stand on them, watch planes and listen to tower and plane traffic, the 737's were just hitting the market. I was on the deck at KABQ and a Frontier 737 was running bad late out of KLAS, with the pilot defintely trying to make up time. For whatever reason, the tower put a Continental DC-9 on his tail. Now, the 737 not only having a slower approach speed but can land in a very short space rather than clear downfield as I'm sure was anticipated. Pilot kissed the roll marks and turned out, not on the first regular turnout, but grabbed the crosswind runway and flipped over to the taxiway. Needless to say, the 9 pilot didn't wait for the tower; it was full throttle, black smoke, gear up and a hard right bank and as tall as a 37's tail is, I venture to say that there was less than 50'clearance as he went by.It was that close. All you heard on the radio a bit later was "Tower, I think we need to have a conference after I get on the ground" and the reply was "Yes Sir". Just goes to show you that plans don't always come together and everything isn't black and white.
ffdriver
Carl McLelland 0
Whew!! But as long as its a system operated by human beings, using equipment constructed and maintained by humans, and no matter how careful we are, there will forever be the possibility of a mechanical or human error. We can do everything within reason to eliminate as many errors as possible, but its inevitable that failures are going to occur from time to time. Only those who don't have to operate the system (managers and politicians) seem able to do so perfectly. Gotta love a system where the person who Cannot do the job is the one who tells others how to do it.
davysims
David Sims 0
You realize this is an article about the NextGen ATC system? The system does away with the tradional arrival and departure patterns that can take aircraft miles off their intended path, and can reduce separation standards greatly because of increased accuracy of GPS. This system is already being used by Southwest airlines at Midway airport, and works great without a hitch.
preacher1
preacher1 0
Yes David, we realize that and when it gets put in place overall and some direct routings in there that will be all well and good but when a plane gets in the pattern, that is where all human intervention,both from controllers and pilots, and throw in mechanical for the occasional emergency, will come into play, and those are the factors that that we, as commercial pilots, have the concern about.

Se connecter

Vous n'avez pas de compte? Inscrivez-vous maintenant (gratuitement) pour des fonctionnalités personnalisées, des alertes de vols, et plus encore!
Ce site web utilise des cookies. En utilisant et en naviguant davantage sur ce site, vous acceptez cela.
Rejeter
Saviez-vous que le suivi des vols FlightAware est soutenu par la publicité ?
Vous pouvez nous aider à garder FlightAware gratuit en autorisant les annonces de FlightAware.com. Nous travaillons dur pour que notre publicité reste pertinente et discrète afin de créer une expérience formidable. Il est facile et rapide de mettre les annonces en liste blanche sur FlightAware ou d’examiner nos comptes premium.
Rejeter